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 Post subject: Re: Hypnosis
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 6:47 am 
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I mentioned the barking like a dog in the context of something that would appear obvious to almost everyone and at least give us some indication that hypnosis was at work or even involved, whereas the stealth of a subtle suggestion goes over our heads and right into our subconscious perceptions of reality.

Some sales people know how to use hypnotic suggestion to increase their sales and convince people to buy things they not only don't need but really don't want. Yet, despite laws to protect consumers most people are too embarrassed or too intimidated to return the merchandise for a full refund, once they get to the oh no moment and ask themselves.....what have I done and why did I do it?

But on a political level we are assured that all is well........there's no super highway and there are no secret prisons......and of course no conspiracy to decrease the world's population.

Chemtrails?.......What chemtrails?........there are no chemtrails....people who believe that sort of thing are just paranoid.....a little less than balanced you might say.....like as in; off their meds.

And the majority of people believe this, because to them it sounds much more rational than the alternative view point. It is also assuring to them that all is well, which they much rather prefer. But wouldn't we all prefer things to be different? Of course we would, but we do not have the luxury of wishful thinking........we're stuck with reality.


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 Post subject: Re: Hypnosis
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 10:33 am 
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From the day we're born we're told what to do and how to do it. We're constantly told do this or don't do that and if we don't stop (or start as the case may be) we're often threatened with violence. If you don't do as I tell you I'll smack you and you do it because I say so and I dont have to give you a reason just do it or else, otherwise we're blackmailed with a lolly or something we want but it's all to the same end of bending to someone elses will. We're contolled and made to live our lives how others dictate. Our free choice is often do you want to do as you're told or do you want a smack. As we get too old for a smack or a lolly our emotions are used against us. If you don't do what I want it will hurt me and upset me and it will be all your fault. Daily guilt trips are dished out. Older still and we become controled by love and sex. Then we're controled by pride. What will people think of you if you go out looking like that and what ever will people say and you don't want people talking about you do you. Then we have national pride and Laws that control us. Every minute of our lives are controled and even in death we're told what where and how we can be burried. We're conditioned to believe that everything we go through is for our own good. Governments and religions lie to us constantly (and they know they are) for our own good. They make up so much crap and find every way they can to make us at least appear to believe it all so they can contol us. They tell us what we can or can't handle "You can't handle the Truth" Even the truth is manipulated and twisted to control us. They tell a few little truths here and there amongst all the lies just to confuse us. We get frustrated and want to hit out only to be told to have self control. What is the genuine no lies honest to God purpose of all this bleeping control. I don't think aliens are here to control us, we've already got that covered. Perhaps their here to free us. Wow, Freedom, now that's a scary concept. None of us have ever had that before. What ever would we do with it. Ann


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 Post subject: Re: Hypnosis
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2008 2:55 pm 
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I can't help but think in practical terms when it comes to control. I agree that there are forces, from birth on up, that control and tip the balance between free thought and action, and what can actually be accomplished with freedom of choice in a practical way.

But why is it always something beyond our control, therefore we moan and groan and think our only way out is 'salvation' from internal, or external forces. Why is it people generally regard life as something that they have no control over. Perhaps it is that living scenereo that is attractive to aliens in the first place. Government tells us there are no aliens, so we don't believe it. Their needs are being met by not being held accountable as to what they know, and how to possibly defend this planet from invasion. With free access to our planet and our species, why would the aliens want to 'free' us in the first place. Their needs are being met too.

There is a lot of money to be made in not telling the truth, from development and deployment of alien technology to win wars, to conquering space frontiers. While pockets are being lined, we wonder why honest disclosure is not forthcoming. Silence is golden, all the way to the bank.

We have allowed ourselves to be so marginalized in self-directed original thought and action, that what we are left with our mouths open and our eyes wide shut, waiting for all our needs to be taken care of while those that control those needs continue to manipulate the truth in ALL aspects of our lives. A crumb here, a crumb there, that's all there is.

Knowing what is true, ie chemtrails, does not necessarily mean anybody is interested enough to do anything about it- sorry, I can't be bothered to do any research because I have to go get a prescription refilled. I know that what David says is true, and Tweaked about chemtrails (just one example), yet those very chemtrails are causing many illnesses that result in yet more prescriptions, but the connections are still not made. We swat the symptoms like we swat flies, with a flyswatter, and never bother to find the cause, or care enough to change it when we do.

That damn government!! They are responsible for all of this. How can I possibly stop those flies- it is totally and completely out of my control. And more flies to swat over fluoride, food additives, etc. etc. etc.

In a more practical sense, and I don't mean to sound bitter or miserable here, is that we still have free choice. We can stop blaming the moulding of our perceived success in this world by shaking off the shackles of bad parenting, mass media influence, crooked politicians, archaic societal rules of behaviour, and religious doctrine. Nobody has to live a non-life because of what, and who shaped it. It is all too easy to sit back and lament the end of the world, because this life has been made so difficult and impossible for me- the next one must certainly be better!!

Why are we so out of control to the extent that we see nothing that can change a very dire and disasterous future. I personally think that if that is coming, we have only ourselves to blame for being led down the garden path in the first place. What a comfortable place those that control us are in- we believe we are controlled, and in so believing, their job just gets easier and easier.

Timbit

p.s. Anne, I hope you don't mind me bouncing this off your post, but you've brought up some points worthy of debate. David is used to me ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Hypnosis
PostPosted: Tue May 27, 2008 5:55 am 
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I guess control is such an all round and varied word. It can mean something really bad or it can mean something really good or it can mean nothing at all. In my own little corner space I control what I do or don't do each day such as what I wear, what I eat etc. My contribution to controling the country is that I vote to let someone else make the choices and expess my opinions. We can't beyond our own young children control other people. That's when it gets frustrating. We see people destroying themselves with alcohol or drugs and we can't stop them and they won't listen and are only interested in their own what they perceive as immediate reward. We set standards for ourselves of what we believe to be fit and proper and attemp our best to live up to them and when we can't we blame an outside cause. We think that because we our selves have a social conscience that everyone should and that they should put the needs of others at the fore front just because we do and consider them selfish if they don't. It's frustrating though when governments and big business say that they have our needs as being paramount to them above all else but by their actions we know that they're lying. They say they care about the family unit but will send young people out to war and to their deaths without batting an eye lid. They themselves would never stand face to face with an armed enemy. They say they want prosperity for all but you be late with a payment of money for anything and they'd rather see you penniless and without food or a home than give you one of their dollars. They get rich off the backs of the poor and hard workers and the poorer you are the harder you have to work. When you have lots of money the most you have to do is open your mouth to give orders. When you find life hard to live and a struggle to keep up with you're condemned as useless or lazy or inept. If you don't aspire to become rich and powerfull you're considered to have little or no intelligence. It's ok to say you care about others but you're not allowed to show it by your actions or your considered weak and having been used. All the double meanings, all the lies seem to be acceptable and no one wants to rock the boat but then again what can we as an individual do anyway. We can't do anything lest we pay a price and suffer a consequence for it. Those people in government and big business, they're not human, I don't know what they are but i'd rather be ruled and controled by an alien who does care than by these inhumane creatures. We have no choice but to accept life as it is doled out for us because the alternative is death. Ann


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 Post subject: Re: Hypnosis
PostPosted: Tue May 27, 2008 6:02 am 
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I'm sorry if I come accross as being so misserable and unhappy because i'm really not it's just when I get into a thought I get pulled into it. Ann


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 Post subject: Re: Hypnosis
PostPosted: Tue May 27, 2008 9:06 am 
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Consequences.........there are always consequences even for those who do nothing.

If anyone thinks they can escape the consequences by keeping their mouth shut and their nose clean they are in for a big surprise......because it doesn't work that way.

Simply ignoring the problem of a fascist style leadership does not make the problem go away nor does it solve anything.........you have to get in their face and rock the boat.

Certainly, under certain conditions, it can be dangerous, but what's the option.......to accept lies and deception.

Take for example the idea of the biological chip.....eventually it will come to that and then what? Without a chip you cannot hold a job, pay a bill or make a purchase.......and if you refuse to go along with the chip you will be an outcast....completely dependent on hand outs and charity. But even that will come to an end and those who refuse to go along will be given a choice....the chip or death, what's it going to be?

It's a bit like branding cattle.....isn't it?

You cannot accept only part of the package.....its all or nothing.

No one wants to die........no one in their right mind at least.......but how much longer will it be until being in your right mind is the exception rather than the rule.........I don't know, but it would appear that the world is headed in that direction.

It's a bit more than an intellectual exercise in conversation......and it's a bit late to say it couldn't happen because it already has........and for so long we are now used to it and for the most part accepting it as being a normal state of affairs.

We rationalize to the absurd.......I know we do because I've done it myself.....to the absurd.

It can't be that.........it has to be this..........but then one day it gets to the point where we are forced to realize that it isn't this at all.......but that which we denied it was. And only then do we begin to realize we have been awoken from a very deep sleep.......we were sleeping our life away despite the fact that we were convinced we were very much awake. It might not be fun, at least not all the time, but I'd rather be awake than asleep.

But if you don't even know you are sleeping how could you possibly wake up........unless someone comes and shakes you and puts the truth right under your nose. Once you smell the truth you are jolted awake because the lies and deception have a very offensive odor...much like a rotting carcass........they stink.


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 Post subject: Re: Hypnosis
PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 9:27 pm 
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I found an article but is dated 2005. It looks good also for these days...


"This is your brain under Hypnosis"
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/11/22/science/22hypno.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

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 Post subject: Re: Hypnosis
PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 11:20 pm 
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It is interesting that there are two main components missing from this story.

One is the relationship with the hypnotist. There has to be a trust and safety. It is unnatural for a human being to not to be suspicious or feel reservation, particularly when they know they are in unfamilar territory, and the general understanding is that people under hypnosis are not in control of what they do. Trust is not instantaneous.

Second is that during the entire hypnosis process, which is only accomplished with a fully conscious, aware person, there is permission. Once trust is established, the one being hypnotised has given permission and cooperates. Without that, there is no hypnotising.

Because of those two elements, they are in a state where if the hypnotist says that red apple is blue, you may allow yourself to see the apple as blue. This voluntary action is quite different than suggesting that a person can be involuntarily hypnotised to kill someone.

There are different levels of consciousness, and there are different levels of relationships. A person hypnotised by a trusted therapist is more likely to respond to suggestions over a period of several sessions. Building on these layers, permission is still required, and nothing is accomplished if the subject is unwilling to further regress. Each layer requires more and more trust.

We have all seen sessions whereby a person, recalling trauma, will exhibit the symptoms and event as though it were happening in real time; the physical memory is being re-lived. It is only a very skilled therapist that will recognize the danger, and end the session. It is also, on the other side of the coin, totally unethical for a therapist to push the limits of the trust established to coerce the person to carry on, even though danger is emminently going to result in further trauma, and is of no therapeutic use to the client.

If the client goes further than he is comfortable with because of the trust in the therapist, it is still a conscious choice, even though in a hypnotic state.

Should anybody consider this type of therapy, it is imperative that they are aware of their own control, and aware of tactics that can be less than credible.

There are some individuals who are more trusting than others, and they are the ones who are more susceptible to hypnosis because they are more trusting. It is those that are perhaps easier subjects because they may presume that a clinician in a white coat with a clipboard is not subject to scrutiny.

But for most of us, the opposite would be true. We are in control.

Tim

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 Post subject: Re: Hypnosis
PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 7:53 am 
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Timbit,

That is a very important post..........oh so true.

Therapy such as that described can cause severe trauma to the client. They are reliving a previous trauma and in doing so are experiencing the trauma all over again. This can be extremely disabilitating and very dangerous.


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 Post subject: Re: Hypnosis
PostPosted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 7:59 am 
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One question though.....are you suggesting that a person under hypnosis or in an controlled state cannot be made to involuntarily kill someone?


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